tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post2902132127237799073..comments2024-01-01T21:57:26.021-05:00Comments on Where the Rubber Hits the Road: Anti-Catholic students protest at university chapel in Madrid :: Catholic News Agency (CNA)Fr. Tim Moylehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comBlogger52125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-33193080269439407022011-03-21T15:21:01.656-04:002011-03-21T15:21:01.656-04:00Martin: You would be more than welcome to visit, o...Martin: You would be more than welcome to visit, or if the place is unoccupied feel free to use it. I share this place with a few whom I trust will respect it whenever its feasible at no cost. Feel free to contact me if you're interested... especially when summer (finally) begins to assert itself. I'm only off for a few weeks and the place is not yet 'booked' for the coming summer. I have every convenience of home (assuming you have a cell phone) and although it's smaller, it's at least as comfortable as Grand Bend. A village of 600 (with a grocery store and a decent take-out place with a five km drive) but excellent swimming, peace and quiet. I think you'd enjoy it.<br /><br />TimFr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-15505140979376320532011-03-19T17:31:55.342-04:002011-03-19T17:31:55.342-04:00"Clearly you thought I was referring to no Ch...<i>"Clearly you thought I was referring to no Christian believers..."</i><br /><br />No I did NOT. You did not specify "Christian" believers, so I had no reason to think that's what you meant. Had you specified "Christian" believers, I would have taken you to task for your errant generalization, because I happen to know for a fact that all Christians do not hate those that are different from them for whatever reasons...be it skin color, religion, or sexual preferences.<br /><br />Stop trying to rewrite what I say and focus on what you see -- <i>exactly</i> what you see -- no more, no less. Don't try to "read between the lines" -- I don't write anything there.<br /><br />And I stand by what I said about your statement.Janus Bellatorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05467165902363025714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-48373980331601318382011-03-18T19:35:38.012-04:002011-03-18T19:35:38.012-04:00Janus
Unlike yourself, I can be thick at times so...Janus<br /><br />Unlike yourself, I can be thick at times so you'll have to forgive me. <br />Clearly you thought I was referring to no Christian believers in my statement below that you so highly endorsed.<br /><br />"Everyone is a sinner. If this statement were true, a believer would have to hate everyone including ones self."<br /><br />Cheers<br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-5814968849424157872011-03-18T14:49:37.208-04:002011-03-18T14:49:37.208-04:00"So you believe Christian's hate everybod...<i>"So you believe Christian's hate everybody?"</i><br /><br />Oh, don't pretend to be so bloody thick, hm? I never mentioned <i>Christians</i>. Deliberately misconstruing what I said is a tactic of the guilty.Janus Bellatorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05467165902363025714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-15394471800390958152011-03-17T21:07:02.638-04:002011-03-17T21:07:02.638-04:00Tim re:Huh? You're bent on bringing "cool...Tim re:Huh? You're bent on bringing "cooler temperatures " into the discussion.It's all about prejudice, hatred, violence, exclusion and exposing lies until a more important topic like The Weather comes to mind.Larry Greennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-4086641556646830032011-03-17T20:26:41.858-04:002011-03-17T20:26:41.858-04:00So you believe Christian's hate everybody? Tha...So you believe Christian's hate everybody? Thats your theory?<br /><br />Cheers<br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-19480444462818366562011-03-17T19:19:01.572-04:002011-03-17T19:19:01.572-04:00"Everyone is a sinner. If this statement were...<i>"Everyone is a sinner. If this statement were true, a believer would have to hate everyone including ones self."</i><br /><br />Exactly, Paul. Very profound, in fact. Well done! Apparently my previous statement made more sense to you than you knew...Janus Bellatorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05467165902363025714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-66360246621511047122011-03-17T18:19:19.259-04:002011-03-17T18:19:19.259-04:00Larry: Huh? Fr. TimLarry: Huh? Fr. TimFr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-13295237870976385462011-03-17T15:53:37.290-04:002011-03-17T15:53:37.290-04:00Hi Tim,
No problem. We are enjoying the more spri...Hi Tim,<br /><br />No problem. We are enjoying the more spring-like weather here in the "big smoke" as well. <br /><br />I am jealous of the cottage. Sounds peaceful...we love friends with cottages. Nudge, nudge...wink wink.<br /><br />Have a gr8 day!<br /><br />Cheers...MartinAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-21264735441951894542011-03-17T15:47:03.785-04:002011-03-17T15:47:03.785-04:00Oh Paul...you are now the martyr. Sniff...sniff......Oh Paul...you are now the martyr. Sniff...sniff...hand me a hanky dude...while I dry my eyes. What an icredibly touching performance. <br /><br />Only problem is:<br /><br />a) you have not retracted your comments;<br />b) you have not apologized;<br />c) you are not silent;<br />d) I fail to understand how your unfettered freedom to incite violence is a core tenant of "orthodox" Catholicsm<br /><br />Look pal, as far as I am concerned you can go on jabbering forever. It won't be me that shuts you up...I imagine decent "orthodox" Catholics will get tired of you discrediting the whole lot of them - and they will tell you to put a sock in it.<br /><br />You know, if I had written the innane things that you have, and I got called out for it...I would have done the decent thing and simply replied:<br /><br />"On second reading, I can see how my earlier comments might have been construed as an incitement to violence and be regarded as demeaning to people suffering from emotional/cognitive disorders. We all exihibit a lapse in good judgement from time to time, and unfortunately, this was one of those occasions for me. I sincerely apologize for any hurt or offence my comments might have caused. In no way did I intend my comments to endorse violence against any persons."<br /><br />Had you done that Paul, you would have earned my respect and that of a good many other folks who read this blog. Instead, you have treated us to an incrediblly boorish display of testosterone fueled, white male privilege.<br /><br />By all means Paul...speak on dude!<br /><br />Cheers...MartinAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-35949897208521657222011-03-17T13:37:39.354-04:002011-03-17T13:37:39.354-04:00Tim : you are clearly troubled and weary at the si...Tim : you are clearly troubled and weary at the sight of your sweat drenched little buddy !Larry Greennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-6785455768952960082011-03-17T10:10:21.866-04:002011-03-17T10:10:21.866-04:00Martin
You're threats of imprisonment have ac...Martin<br /><br />You're threats of imprisonment have achieved their goal, silencing outrage and ensure unhindered assaults on churches by criminal hate mongers everywhere. Congratulations! <br /><br />Janus<br /><br />This statement makes no sense:<br /><br />"And don't try to tell me or anyone else here that the hate is on the sin rather than the sinner because we're all too smart to believe that. You cannot separate the sin from the sinner, so when you hate the one, you automatically must hate the other."<br /><br />Everyone is a sinner. If this statement were true, a believer would have to hate everyone including ones self. I do agree with you though that some people are hated personally simply for being gay and this is wrong. The antics of Phelps and his congregation would certainly support that idea. <br />Mother Theresa believed homosexuality activity was sinful yet she was one of the first people to start a care facility in America for people dying of AIDS. Do you think she hated gay people? Really? There are many examples of hate the sin, love the sinner in the world. Your blanket statement just doesn't hold up.<br /><br />Cheers<br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-19631081546676223702011-03-17T08:10:39.450-04:002011-03-17T08:10:39.450-04:00Martin: Personal note of thanks! Today is the 2nd...Martin: Personal note of thanks! Today is the 2nd day with predicted temps above zero! Seems you did bring some warmer weather back from your trip. I appreciate you sharing it with we frozen northeners.<br /><br />TimFr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-72913194584451042912011-03-17T08:02:17.753-04:002011-03-17T08:02:17.753-04:00And so we have Paul's sincere apology...whinin...And so we have Paul's sincere apology...whining to the end that he is more sinned against than sinner.<br /><br />I have demonstrated that he has advocated for violence twice, and lied once in this thread, and this is the thin gruel of an apology with which he favors us.<br /><br />And had I not mentioned "police", "incitement to violence", and "IP address" I doubt we would have even seen this much.<br /><br />Cheers...Martin<br /><br />Very instructive...<br /><br />Cheers...MartinAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-63198363265427311482011-03-16T21:18:14.911-04:002011-03-16T21:18:14.911-04:00IF your cattle need straw, call Martin. He's g...IF your cattle need straw, call Martin. He's got plenty.<br /><br />"For your information, you are not Jesus Christ, therefore, you ought to be very careful about taking on the mantle of divine retribution. At best it smacks of arrogance...at worst it looks like delusion."<br /> <br />Yes Martin, I'm the messiah. LOL!<br /><br />Keep stuffin bud!<br /><br />Cheers<br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-79795464208612168242011-03-16T19:16:35.087-04:002011-03-16T19:16:35.087-04:00Tim this was my missing comment.
You are not a cen...Tim this was my missing comment.<br />You are not a censor and you have never had any problems with my comments in the past but you have accused me of name calling ( which I have not done ) and warned that if I continued , my voice would be shut down.<br />Truth is that you have'nt cleared up anything for me , I see much more clearly than you think.<br />For sure you cleared it up for your appeasing buddy Paul though.larrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-31616853899160243222011-03-16T19:04:08.125-04:002011-03-16T19:04:08.125-04:00"Regarding the Lord and his whip, if Jesus wa...<i>"Regarding the Lord and his whip, if Jesus was justified in chasing money changers out of the temple, I think he'd have done no less with those that would desecrate his church with violence, sacrilege and obscenity."</i><br /><br />Y'know, I can't help but notice that you haven't explained <i>why</i> the money-changers were in the temple in the first place, Paul. Or perhaps you don't know that they performed an essential service? Seems incredible to me that you, a self-identified Christian with biblical familiarity wouldn't know this, and that making such a comparison to what happened here makes no sense. But perhaps history does not play a part in the game of, "what I would have done if I had been there."<br /><br />As for this incident's being an "unprovoked" attack, that is simply not the case. This was <i>retaliation</i> for the attacks by the institution of the church against citizens <i>who have committed no crime</i>. Yet that institution feels free to deny them human rights, human feelings, simple courtesy, and the right to follow one's own path without interference from those not affected by it.<br /><br />It is unfortunate that some people got roughed up. Perhaps even people who aren't an active part of the anti-gay movement. Just passive at it. But the saying goes, you can't make an omelet without breaking eggs. The military calls it "collateral damage." At least no one was beaten to death for being Catholic, right? <br /><br />You are pleased to call it "sacrilege" when someone "spoils" an inanimate edifice belonging to a religious institution. What do you call it when that institution promulgates hatred against people? And don't try to tell me or anyone else here that the hate is on the sin rather than the sinner because we're all too smart to believe that. You cannot separate the sin from the sinner, so when you hate the one, you automatically must hate the other.Janus Bellatorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05467165902363025714noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-75049495744400369242011-03-16T18:47:49.180-04:002011-03-16T18:47:49.180-04:00Larry: Was this your missing comment?
Paul expres...Larry: Was this your missing comment?<br /><br />Paul expresses himself clearly. He is a big boy (I assume) and can speak for himself. What he wrote is not different in tone or tenor from some of the things that you have previously posted here that would be offensive to priests in specific or Catholics in general. I've had no problem with your comments in the past (nor with this one). I doubt I'll have problems with what you post in the future. I would say the same to Paul.<br /><br />I am not a censor. I am not an elementary school teacher telling everyone to behave and speak nicely to each other. Some of our conversations here generate a great deal of heat. There's nothing wrong with that.<br /><br />Hope this clears it up for you. <br /><br />Fr. Tim<br /><br />(BTW: I checked in my comments, spam and past comments boxes that blogger provides and I cannot find your earlier comment. If this is not a reposting of that comment, please feel free to send it along again.)Fr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-360638954253260742011-03-16T18:23:14.681-04:002011-03-16T18:23:14.681-04:00Will any of the "Christians" ever have t...Will any of the "Christians" ever have the courage and humility to at least sometime accept and admit that at the very least sometimes they are wrong and the truth has been beautifully demonstrated by a " non-Christian. "<br /> <br />Tim : you said, "so long as comments are civil and intelligent, they will be posted. As I said, if there's a problem... I'll let you know." Is there some sort of behind the scenes group you need to confide in before making decisions about who’s in and who’s out ? From the view over here, Paul clearly fails miserably on every aspect of the stipulated criteria. <br /><br />Paul : Larry is not trying to turn “ this “ into anything. Martin has quite properly addressed the fact that you use this website to advocate for violence against protesters. I have addressed the discriminatory elements of your comments. You ‘re comments were offensive and harmful to people with mental illness , their loved ones, their friends and to the common good. The implicit assumption is that the activity in question can be explained by the “ typical “ behaviour of people who are predisposed to a psychosis . Not a chance it could be a tactic employed by some very normal , courageous, and good people who can no longer “ sit on their hands “ to shock someone into listening. It worked. Not Martin nor I is “ trying to make you the problem” , the point is that you are already very much a part of “the problem.”<br />Paul, Again<br />Would you mind apologizing to my friends who live with a psychotic disorder along with all the other marginalized good people you regularly degrade , devalue and condemn ? <br /><br />Not sure what you call this Tim , if not uncivil , unintelligent , name calling? Maybe if Paul would have said something like “ bare ass cancer patients” or “ bare ass bitches “ or “ bare ass retards “ , not sure what name specifically would raise concern for you, surely you could think of at least one.Larry Greennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-68220543788396960862011-03-16T18:17:28.421-04:002011-03-16T18:17:28.421-04:00Larry: No. When did you send it?
Fr. TimLarry: No. When did you send it?<br /><br />Fr. TimFr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-73378135292463136412011-03-16T18:15:05.548-04:002011-03-16T18:15:05.548-04:00Tim did you receive a comment from me that you did...Tim did you receive a comment from me that you did'nt post ?larrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-83165443357693033522011-03-16T17:47:08.118-04:002011-03-16T17:47:08.118-04:00Hi Paul,
For your information, you are not Jesus ...Hi Paul,<br /><br />For your information, you are not Jesus Christ, therefore, you ought to be very careful about taking on the mantle of divine retribution. At best it smacks of arrogance...at worst it looks like delusion.<br /><br />I find it ironic that you encourage violence against "Fred Phelps and his gang", while simultaneously whinging on that you have been unfairly characterized as an advocate of violence (i.e. a member of the new "Catholic Taliban").<br /><br />Do you ever read the stuff you write before pressing the "Post Comment" button? <br /><br />I suppose this is as close to a real apology that we will ever see from you.<br /><br />Seriously Paul, nothing I can write here condemns you more eloquently than your own words.<br /><br />Carry on buddy.<br /><br />Cheers...MartinAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-17682117763841954182011-03-16T15:42:27.087-04:002011-03-16T15:42:27.087-04:00Tim gets it. My table turning line was me giving a...Tim gets it. My table turning line was me giving a smart ass response to Larry's? smart ass attempt to belittle my understanding of the scriptures in play. I'll retract it for those not able to make the connection and I apologize if I offended anyone planning to break laws by shove my priest aside, jump up on the altar, show their naughty parts and release a deluge of hate speech on an unsuspecting audience of men women and children.<br /><br />I stand corrected. The chaplain remained on his feet when he was assaulted by the protestors. <br />"The group of students stormed into the chapel with a megaphone and pushed the chaplain out of the way"<br />So yes, the assault didn't result in a fall. My bad.<br /><br />Regarding the Lord and his whip, if Jesus was justified in chasing money changers out of the temple, I think he'd have done no less with those that would desecrate his church with violence, sacrilege and obscenity. I think the verse says being a Christian doesn't require one be a doormat when your faith is attacked. I may be wrong but thats how I read it.<br /><br />If Fred Phelps and his gang showed up at a gay man's funeral and tried to pull the same kind of stunt, I'd not be disturbed if someone decided to show them to the back door or bar their entrance to the assembly just the same.<br /><br />Call me old school but this kind of behaviour is reprehensible and you've lost your peaceful protestor status when you launch such assaults. <br /><br />"I think we all need to be careful about creating an atmosphere which normalizes and legitimzes violence." I find this statement ironic coming from someone lobbing terms around like "Taliban Catholics".<br /><br />Cheers<br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-4817816471156266632011-03-16T11:24:55.158-04:002011-03-16T11:24:55.158-04:00Martin: You wrote: "PS: Was just in Nassau ...Martin: You wrote: "PS: Was just in Nassau - but forgot to bring back the warm Caribbean breezes and the azure cloudless skies. Maybe next year."<br /><br />To which I immediately feel envy!!! Lucky fellow. I've been to Nassau once to visit some nuns from Pembroke who have a convent there. Only spent a couple of days (it was a side trip from a vacation in Florida) but it was wonderful!! Your description inspires me to start my little 'winter vacation savings fund' again. (The past two years have been dedicated to paying off debt from renovating my cottage. That will finally be done in another three months so I can start to save in earnest for a trip next winter.<br /><br />TimFr. Tim Moylehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18030197987469327645noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1926891106758008587.post-23167583176317947852011-03-16T11:20:35.693-04:002011-03-16T11:20:35.693-04:00Hi Tim,
You are correct about the laws in Canada....Hi Tim,<br /><br />You are correct about the laws in Canada. I am not suggesting for a moment that the protesters should NOT be held legally accountable for their actions. I simply note that I can understand WHY protesters would target the church. IMHO if Jesus were to return to earth today, I suspect he would re-enact the cleansing of the temple...likely starting in Rome and carrying on to every mega-church in the USA (many of whom are funnelling political contributions into Republican PACs).<br /><br />As to whether or not Paul was serious in his incitement to violence, I will let him speak for himself. He is certainly free to retract his statements and to apologize. I can only judge him by what he writes. <br /><br />Regardless of Paul's "seriousness" I think we all need to be careful about creating an atmosphere which normalizes and legitimzes violence. I get very concerned when I see scripture used as a justification for violence. Radical Islam does it - and so apparently do many fundamentalist or "orthodox" Christians.<br /><br />Cheers...Martin<br /><br />PS: Was just in Nassau - but forgot to bring back the warm Carribean breezes and the azure cloudless skies. Maybe next year.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com